UPDATE #5: UNC officially announced that Tyler Zeller had suffered a broken wrist from his fall under the basket against Kentucky. Zeller was admitted to UNC hospitals today and had successful surgery on his left wrist. The injury is likely to be season ending with the timeframe for recovery by his doctors is 12-16 weeks. That being said if he recovers quickly he could be available by mid-February. Even if he takes the full 16 weeks he might be available by the ACC Tournament. The question would be whether Roy wants to use Zeller and waste the year on what could end up being 11 games at most. There is also an element of meshing him into the team at that point which may not work. Still if he is available it does not hurt to have more depth at that point in the season.
As for Zeller, this really sucks. He was playing well despite the quiet stat line last night. He also would have benefited tremendously from playing alongside the other Tyler and I was quite looking forward to see those two on the court together. As it is he will watch and learn but hopefully be ready to go next season if he ends up sitting the rest of this one out.
Original post and updates after the jump.
UPDATE #4: Okay, now we have Gary Parrish quoting Zeller’s brother Luke, who plays for Notre Dame, saying that they were looking for a surgeon and he was likely out for the season. Apparently Tyler thought he could splint it and since it was his left hand he’d be fine. Still waiting on official word from UNC which could be late tonight since I doubt they release information without talking to Roy first and he will be in transit to CA this evening.
This really sucks for Tyler Zeller on so many levels. You hate to see an injury especially one at a meaningless point in the game via a foul that probably should not have been committed. Also add to this the fact Tyler was probably looking forward to being in Maui and playing against his brother Luke if UNC met Notre Dame in the championship game of the tournament. Now he is going to be stuck in Chapel Hill, possibly having surgery on the wrist and missing what usually is a bonding trip for the team.
UPDATE #3: ESPN’s Andy Katz says UNC is still evaluating the injury calling it “serious” and that Zeller is out indefinitely.
North Carolina freshman forward Tyler Zeller suffered a “serious injury” to his left hand and wrist on a dunk attempt late in Tuesday night’s win over Kentucky, an injury that will keep him out of the Tar Heels’ lineup for the foreseeable future.
North Carolina spokesman Steve Kirschner said the school would have more information on the injury once team doctors examined Zeller later Wednesday afternoon in Chapel Hill. Kirschner said that Zeller would not likely join the team on its Wednesday evening flight to Santa Barbara, Calif., for its game against UC-Santa Barbara on Friday night, or the team’s three games next week at the Maui Invitational in Hawaii.
I am purely guessing but they are probably trying to decide if it needs surgery or not. If it does he is done for the season. If is a break that can heal in a cast and then get rehab he may yet play again this season. If it takes 8-12 weeks for it to heal assuming there is no surgery, that is, at worst mid-February. Also, this is not his shooting hand which means he could probably get by with his off hand not being at full strength such as when he is playing defense which may end up being his greater value.
UPDATE #2: Jeff Goodman is reporting Tyler Zeller is out for the season with a broken left wrist.
UPDATE: No official word yet but the rumor is the wrist is broken and Zeller is probably out for the season. Please proceed with your favorite method of venting at this time.
–
In case you missed it, Tyler Zeller was fouled hard on a breakaway dunk attempt with 1:26 remaining in the game and landed on his left wrist. Zeller was in obvious pain and taken immediately to the locker room. Based on the way Roy addressed it and other comments from Woody Durham on the radio the wrist is believed to be broken. Zeller was taken to UNC hospitals for X-rays to see if that is the case or not. We will wait and see what news comes from that.
Also, let’s go ahead and get this out of the way now because someone will be stupid enough ask why Zeller was still in the game. The answer is all the starters were still in save Deon Thompson who fouled out. Also, with Tyler Hansbrough and Mike Copeland out plus Thompson’s foul issue, Ed Davis and Zeller were the only true big men UNC had available. Plus he is a freshman and could use the playing time.
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Can you adequately heal from a broken wrist? I really hate this happened to a freshmen looking to gain confidence & fit into the system. I must say I am a little worried for basketball’s sake given our injuries, and some tougher games lie ahead. Although his productivity hasn’t been real impressive, he still is a 7 footer that has to be reckoned with in the paint for opposing teams. We will need that going forward. Hope his recovery can be swift and 100 percent. Great job by the heels tonight, but after that landfall for Zeller, that is all of us heel fans can think about right now. Get Well Zeller!
poop.
Looks like Hansbrough will be back a little earlier.
One other thing we should get out of the way… it was not a dirty foul. Unnecessary? Yes, but it wasn’t dirty.
Josh,
First, until there is confirmation, we should all hold off on calling it broken. Even a doctor wouldn’t render a diagnosis through a TV screen. That being said, breaks can come in all different flavors, so it is hard to say what the time table would be. The good news is that it was his off hand.
As for the bball part of it: Hansbrough/Thompson/Davis is a much better front line than last years version of Hansbrough/Thompson/Stepheson (Deon is playing much better, and Ed appears to be far ahead of Alex) so UNC should still have more than enough to be the clear favorites, assuming the obvious… which, for those who believe in jinxes, I will refrain from stating!
I had DVD’d the game and re-watched Zeller’s attempted dunk and then fall in frame-by-frame. UK’s player really didn’t do anything wrong. The normal basketball play is to get your hand up near the backboard and see if you can swipe at the ball. The problem was that Zeller was going for a showtime dunk and instead of going straight at the basket, he kind of went to the right of the basket for a tomahawk. The UK player and Zeller barely touched, but it was enough to knock Zeller off balance and fall.
From there, Zeller caught himself with his left hand. I once fell backward playing bball, caught myself with my left hand, and broke a small bone in my hand. I had to have a cast on for 3 or 4 months. But it all depends on what bone you break.
And to his credit, Harris came back to pat Tyler on the back and stood by him for quite a while.
I’ve also seen some people blaming this on people being too close to the court. While that is often legit, in this case, the first thing he hit was the base of the basket and that really cause it all. Just a freak accident.
I’d love to see this team in action with all the pieces in place. Hopefully that will transpire around January or so.
I listened to Woody after the game and Dr. Taft said “it didn’t look good” which I take to mean Tyler had some deformity or immediate swelling. There are many variations of a broken wrist. We can only hope surgery won’t be required, meaning “only” 4-6 weeks out.
If you had to ask me which of the 4 big men I had to lose, I would respectfully pick Zeller at this point. Davis is a monster on the boards and with his D. Soft jump hook as well.
On Zeller’s wrist, C.Michael probably is right that we should not speculate, but it did look pretty bad, and I’m not speculating that he could be done for the season.
With respect to the game itself, they looked great the first 10 minutes or so, then seemed to let up as if they already had won the game. They lost their intensity and concentration. They won the first 8 minutes and 26 seconds by 19 points. The remaining 31 minutes and 34 seconds they coasted to a 52-52 tie.
Early in the season, and something to work on.
Heels Perspective makes a very good point about Ed Davis. In Danny’s PC Monday, he said Davis remineded him of Brandan Wright and I thought that couldn’t be right. After last night though, I realized Danny was right and Ed is much better offensively that I figured. Bottom line is he does know how to put the ball in the basket. His agressiveness on the boards is also great.
Of course, Zeller can spread the court with his shooting range, which is what we have needed for the past few years to compliment Hansbrough. On the other hand, do you take Deon off the court? Who knows.
I kind of see Ed as a hybrid of Brandon Wright and Alex Stepheson… not quite as long or athletic as Brandon, but a similar skill set offensively, with what appears to be Alex’s tenacity mixed in… not a bad combination, IMO!
Zeller is a big loss if his wrist is indeed broken. He’s showing signs of being a stud and I would hate to see him lose any time to injury.
On another note, did anyone else think that upon seeing the Obama clip, the foreshadowing in his practice with the Heels earlier this year is now at Shakespearian levels?? I’m seeing another meeting between the basketball team and our new president come April!
C. Michael. I was merely quoting Roy & Woody, I was not “speculating”! Also, who said it was a “dirty foul”? What has angered you to say all of this? I have heard no one say it was a dirty foul, nor have I heard anyone define the wrist as broken, of course it is speculation at this point. What’s wrong with that? Hell, all of ESPN’s commentary is based on speculation. Are we fans to be exempt from doing that?
Sorry, didn’t intend for you to take the brunt of that, should have been a more blanket statement.
Did anyone hear during the Telecast that Ginyard is not healing as well as expected??
Yeah, he is apparently slightly behind schedule with his rehab, which is not necessarily the same thing as not healing well. From what I’ve read the time table now is the end of December, not the beginning. So he should be more than ready for the bulk of ACC play.
That is consistent with what I have heard.
I agree that we can’t rush to judgment on Zeller’s injury and worry about a break. If it is, then we’ll have to deal with that, and maybe see Hansbrough a little sooner than Roy would like. Maybe it’s just a strain/sprain or sorts — hard to say, IMO speculation only spins off rumors and ideas that Zeller’s career will be off track and UNC will crumble without a good backup for Hansbrough, heaven forbid, something happens to him down the stretch. That kind of wild speculation just pulls us off track and away from the fact that we’ve got a really good chance of winning the whole thing again this year.
Is this commentary on Marcus Ginyard “speculation” ? J/K J/K J/K
I didn’t mean to sound rude C. Michael. Are there folks giving you a hard time saying that UNC fans are obnoxious for calling this a dirty foul on Zeller. There may be some among us that think that, but no UNC fan I have been associated with considers that a dirty foul at all. The worst possible situation for Zeller would be a broken wrist, and it is not out of the question that he may have one. Given that, we have to move forward based on that assumption, as well as others, are indeed possible. I tend to plan on the worst possible scenario when planning things out, so I was just curious myself what would happen from here if that were so. I was in no way trying to “diagnose” his injury. Just planning on what we would do if things played out that way.
No, not at all. I just saw posts on other sites (mostly national, so that may tell you something) calling Harris out, and figured I’d just vent at place where I know the readers to be sane!!
I agree that most fans saw nothing malicious in the play.
Good to hear. I never want to criticize a player for playing good defense. And bad things can happen in the nature of a bb game. Unlike the GH thing, where that appeared to me to be frustration and not merely trying to play good defense, this was just a bad occurence. I do not mind speculation however. We all have to make decisions thinking about all the possibilities. It would be speculation to say Zeller’s Ok. It would be speculation to say he is injured for the rest of the season. Roy Williams has to take all of this into account to plan his next few games. I think any speculation that would have taken place here that is not necessary would be the speculation that the foul itself was of harmful intent. Someone can “spec” all they want, but to me the evidence is against such a charge. Don’t let those inferior minds getcha down C. Michael.
I think the foul was unnecessary. He was going the ball granted but it is a dangerous play because it happens 9-10 feet above the ground and if you lose balance that is a lot of force coming down.
I think the question is whether the UK player was trying to make a legitimate basketball play. It is possible to block a shot from behind by smacking the backboard. Danny Green is good at this. It probably isn’t possible to block a 7-footers shot this way normally, but by coming at the basket from the side, the UK player had a shot. If Zeller had been able to see he was being chased down, he would not have gone for the tomahawk. These things just happen.
I tend to side with the speculation that Zeller is, at best, out 4-6 weeks. While it is true that Ed Davis may be the more well-rounded player, losing Tyler 2.0 just plain sucks. While he looked a little soft out there, especially on defense, his ability to run the court was stunning…as good as advertised. Now, with Copeland saddled and Tyler 1.0 easing back into the mix, our depth at the five is a little too shallow for my taste.
Ugh,the dreaded UNC injury bug. I’m hoping that this season doesn’t end the way the 1977 season did…with a boatload of talent, and as many injuries to match. Please sports gods, please…
I have to say I am a little frightened myself. A couple more pushovers to go, then we might be facing a Texas or Notre Dame. I do not feel good playing either of those two teams without Hans or Zeller. However, the healthy guys still look good enough to beat them, I just don’t feel “comfortable” playing w/o them.
IC says done for season.
While facing Texas or ND w/o Tyler 1/2 or Ginyard is not ideal, I also see it as a no-lose situation. The worst thing that could happen is they lose, which, in the grand scheme of things, means nothing. But if they win, it just gives the team that much more confidence… which could almost be a Pyrrhic victory, if it leads to a false sense of invincibility when they regain their health.
If I’m not mistaken, that rumor is based on a “text from my daughter.” Color me skeptical…
Remember, Louisville went through this last season and by the time the tournament rolled around they were very good. I think we have more depth and talent than they did last season so they should be able to whether this.
THF,
Good call. The bottom line is that so long as Tyler comes back and stays healthy, then this injury to Tyler, while unfortunate, really has no bearing on the type of season UNC is capable of.
This is terrible news for Zeller. The team is still far more talented than anyone in the country and still should have a magical season, but you have to feel for the individual, in this case. At least there will be no question about getting him a redshirt, so he will still have four, full, years to compete as a Heel.
You hate it for this kid and I hope he returns to one day have his jersey in the Dean Dome rafters.
The immediate problem with this is that with Zeller in the lineup, we could afford to rest Hansbrough a few extra minutes every game. AND, we simply can’t afford anymore injuries at all. In fact getting Copeland back to give Deon some rest becomes an issue. (I can’t believe I just typed that)…….
Marcus needs to heal as well. Damn.
This is a depth issue at this point. If Hansbrough does not play against UCSB your two legitimate frontline players are Thompson and Davis. There is no one else taller than 6-6 available just them.
That being said, I hope this doesn’t lead to Hansbrough coming back too soon… much better to lose a couple of games in November than it is to lose TH for an extended period.
Depth shouldn’t be an issue once TH comes back though. Three bigs (plus DG at the end of the game) is all they had last year, too. And Ed should warrant more minutes then Alex did.
Sounds like Zeller is done and there goes our front-line depth. I think we’ll see more of Green at the “4″ until TH is ready to go full steam. I think we’ll still see limited minutes for him throughout Maui, but not having Ginyard and moving some of Green’s minutes to the “4″ stretches us a little thin on the perimeter.
We very well may be fine, even in those Maui games. We really don’t know. I feel optimistic with our current lineup til the ACC starts. As long as we can play good peremiter defense, we will run our break & be fine.
crap
that’s all i got, dangit, crap, darn, argh, ugh, yeck, bleh, d@m#*t,
Unfortunately, this is not just about depth or about Zeller’s year. Z is our future big man, and this was his year to become fully integrated with the Carolina system. He will be able to observe and absorb, but he’ll come in next year like a freshman.
First off, we’re going to have to start using last names to identify players (C. Michael).
Second, does anyone have an opinion as to what this means for Graves? Are we going to see him get minutes and play as a true forward instead of a swingman?
^Until Hansbrough returns then something of that nature.
This is depressing. Poor Zeller. My prayers are with him. We need Tyler(H)now more than ever. Waiting for Roy’s verdict. Is Z still going to CA and HI?
Good grief. Enough of this. In order to play basketball you need a basketball team. A month ago we had one. Whether we do now is open to question.
I am generally a believer that what happens to you in life is more a function of how you deal with adversity than with adversity itself. But there are limits, and we have reached ours.
Sorry to vent, but there is just so much of this you can listen to. On the other hand, at least the stock market is doing well.
OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOPS!!!
Yeah, as soon as I posted that I realized that it would not read well… my bad.
rathskellar (great name, BTW), look at it this way, you are taking a team that blasted Kentucky by 19, removing a player who scored 2 points and was largely invisible, and replacing him with the reigning NPOY. That’s still one heck of a team, IMO.
C,Michael,
The problem is that our frontcourt depth has disappeared. Plus we don’t know when Hansbrough will be back, and whenever it is, every one of us will be holding his breath for the rest of the season anytime he gets hit or falls, wondering whether the shin has been re-injured or broken and our national championship hopes have just gone bye-bye.
Zeller had an unproductive game last night, but he was the team high scorer against Penn, and he brings things no other big man does: running the floor, the outside shot, and all seven feet of him.
Thanks for the compliments on the moniker. The Rat was my home away from home. The quality of the food varied, shall we say, but when something is part of your college years, it’s part of you. I was miserable when it closed. Maybe Washington should give a new owner part of this bailout money everyone else has his hand out for.
Failing that, I did get some Rat skillets from the auction, so it lives on on my dining room table.
UNC posted that he broke both the radius and ulna…that’s brutal.
Best wishes on a speedy recovery!
16 week is mid-March. It would be tough to come back that late, but if you are playing for a NC, why not? He should be healthy other than the wrist. The dude is 7′, that is not going to change.
How many games can Zeller play and still qualify for the medical redshirt? He has already played in 2 games, so if he is back by ACC Tourney time, could he sneak in a few games and still redshirt? Or is that a no-no? If he could still be ready to suit up, we could hold him out unless we needed him during a game, right?
Sorry I don’t know the rules, but I used my NCAA rulebook as a boat anchor and accidentally lost it when it got caught on an oyster bed…
Can’t cite a definitive source, but it looks like you have to play in less than 20% of the games played and only those games played in the first half of the season. Sounds like he would not be able to play in March and keep the possibility of a medical redshirt as an option.